♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ Lakeland Public Television presents Currents. ♪ ♪ Hello and welcome to Lakeland Currents.
I'm Bethany Wesley. Tonight we focus our spotlight on
housing. More specifically we will be discussing a growing
need in out state Minnesota for the develop of
more workforce housing. While you may occasionally hear
about the need for some job growth though out greater
Minnesota in some cities the
jobs are there. Or could be there. But the
companies that are wanting to expand or establish
themselves there are reluctant
to do so because there is not enough
middle income housing for would
be employees.
So what exactly is
work force housing? And why is there a shortage of
it? To answer these questions and to discuss potential
solutions, tonight we welcome
to the program Dan Dorman, the executive
director of the Greater Minnesota Partnership.
And Tim Flathers, the executive director of the
Headwaters Regional Development
Commission. Welcome! Welcome back. Tim:
Thanks, Bethany. Dan: Thank
you. Thank you for having us. Bethany: As we
get started why don't you tell
us a little bit about what the Greater Minnesota
Partnership is. Dan: Sure,
Greater Minnesota Partnership is an advocacy organization
that works on economic development issues in greater
Minnesota, for greater
Minnesota. So our goal and our mission is
to try to create ah, better jobs, improve job
quality, improve the quality of
life helping to build tax base,
vital cities, vibrant cities, but exclusively
in greater Minnesota. One thing that you know, we
noticed that ah.. the metropolitan area just
because that's where you're at, herded up together, easier to
organize.
They have a stronger
voice at the capitol. So, our job is to try
to make sure greater Minnesota doesn't get lost in the hubbub
in the mix. And so, we advocate again for
greater Minnesota economic development programs. Bethany:
Tim, our viewers hopefully will recognize you
from an earlier appearance. But
tell us a little bit about what the HRDC's role is with housing
specifically. Tim: Well, housing is an issue
that is pretty broad within our organization and
we're really interested in ah, meeting housing needs of
communities throughout the region. It includes development
of housing, we've focused on affordable housing principally.
We have a non-profit subsidiary corporation that
does housing development work. Ah, we also provide staff
support to a couple um, or three right now
housing and redevelopment authorities. And
um, we do things such as housing
rehabilitation work, ah down payment
assistance. Um, and ah, um…trying to make
sure that people have access to affordable mortgage
financing products.
Um, particularly in the home
ownership side. So we do a variety of different things in
the area of housing. Bethany:
And will you remind our viewers, if you'd be so kind,
in terms of what your footprint
is in terms of what the HRDC manages? Tim:
Yeah, the HRDC ah, regional development commission
serves 5 counties. We're
headquartered here in Bemidji. Ah, we go down to
Park Rapids and serve Hubbard county. And then west
we go to Clearwater county and Mahnomen county. And then
north Lake of the Woods county. So, we serve Baudette for
example. Bethany: Ok. Alright so as we turn our
attention to work force housing, Dan, what…can you tell us how
do you define work force
housing? How does it differ from let's
say, low income housing? Dan: Yeah, I think Bethany the
easiest way to think about it
is… middle earners. If you think
about like specific jobs it isn't about low income like food manufacturing workers
or something because there's
already programs for that.
But it could be anyone
from a beginning nurse
beginning teacher, or of course the
manufacturing jobs. Kind of that pay range of maybe
15 to 25 dollars an hour right there.
It's, you make too much to
qualify for low income stuff but for some
reason that I really can't explain the market isn't
responding like it should and
creating in this case, what we're
advocating is more rental
housing that will lead to single family
home ownership. But it's about making sure that
that ah, there's a housing supply
available for those people when those jobs are created.
And it's an issue it's a growing issue. As
we…you mentioned earlier in
almost all parts of greater Minnesota.
From the southwest corner to
northeast northwest, ah central
Minnesota.
It is a ah, like I said it's a
growing deal and it's starting
to hurt our ah, economic development
and job creation in these cities. And so we
think it's important that the legislature ah…..takes an
action. Ah, we have a tax credit
proposal we think would work. Sort of copied it
from our neighbors North Dakota and Iowa. We cobbled something
together, you know. Better to you know not reinvent something
there's…you know steal an
idea that seems to work. And ah, we think it would
really help these communities continue to grow and prosper.
Bethany: When did the issue
really kind of start to emerge? When did you
start to hear things from communities that said, you know
we really could use some more of this market rate or middle
income housing? Tim: Um, from my perspective we
first started hearing about
work force housing back in the mid 90's. And it
became an issue. But I think the characteristic
over the past few years in my estimation anyway, um, we started to hear more and more
about work force housing for um, moderate income people or higher income people.
I don't
think that's a traditional part
of the issue. Um, the market's being
broken I think is a new twist on a very old problem
that we've had. [Ok] Dan: I live in Albert Lea
and it's funny you say the mid
90's cause that's when it started to
become an issue there, started
to talk about it. Ah, you know form
committees, and how are we
going to do this? And our local communities
really don't have the tools
they need to respond to it. But I would
agree with what Tim said. So
there was more maybe rehabilitation, low
income. Ah that seems to have worked it's
way through in many
communities. But it's that, you know…you
don't make enough that you know you don't make 50
dollars an hour. But you've got
that, again that new teacher or new
technician ah, they're having a hard time
finding quality ah, a quality place to live.
And what does that..
What does that do? Well, it
becomes a competitive issue.
Well, why do I want to live in this
community? I want a decent
place to live and raise my family and so. Ah,
we think that it's an important issue to be
solved. I'd say it started in
some ways in the mid 90's but really over
the last probably 10 years that middle income has really
ah, grown in importance. And the legislature
so far hasn't reacted you know, there's always that
lag right? Makes some sense,
but ah, it's really on the
forefront.
The state is very
active in housing. We've done roughly ah,
almost 100 million dollars a year in
primarily the low income stuff.
So, the state does have an active
role and plays an active role
in housing. In a lot of ways we think this is
just an area that needs some
attention. Bethany: Tell me a little bit
about how wide spread the issue is. We talk a lot
about rural or outstate or
greater Minnesota is it throughout all those
areas? Are there pockets of it that are experiencing it
more than others? Dan: You
know, I think there definitely is. I think when you
look at ah, you know on the
news lately Thief River Falls and a
possible expansion by Digi-Key they've got a problem. Roseau,
ah down in my neck of the woods both Albert Lea and Austin you
know. The interesting thing ah,
the city manager from Austin was in
St.
Paul this week to testify in behalf of our bill. They
haven't built a market rate apartment building in Austin,
right, home of Hormel, hasn't
built a market rate apartment building in 45 years.
And it is getting to be a problem for
them. So we hear, you know
there. It's maybe not quite the same
issue even though they have
different housing issues in communities like St.
Cloud, Rochester, Mankato. Ah, they probably have some
different issues. But still an
issue for them as well. Ah, there's some pockets in the
metropolitan area that would
say they they have needs. But it's
really different. Because in a
metropolitan area they have seen ah….growth in this area. And people are
building apartments. And you
know the one thing that… I think makes the case for
state investment is if you think about other state
investments in metropolitan
areas it's really helped their their housing market.
You look
at the light rail, the green
line light rail, the proposed southwest
ah, light rail corridor. When that was being talked
about I remember there was an
article in the… …Star Tribune. And there was
a big fight going on over you know, what kind of
housing was, might create too
much high income. Not enough of low
income and all this and I'm
thinking you know what a good problem to
have, right? We don't have
those mega investments by the state that
help create housing in greater Minnesota. That's why we think
that some of the proposals that
we're advocating makes sense and would bring
some equity to the distribution
of state resources. Bethany: So as I was
preparing for this you know you look at different
articles and different research
out there, and they said that there are
businesses that want to expand or you know, either relocate or
expand.
But they are hampered because there's
not enough housing. You're
hearing that repeatedly then. Dan: Right.
And they're writing checks. You
know you look at AGCO in Jackson, you look at
Digi-Key you look at Polaris. You've got these corporations
that are also writing checks to
help stimulate this. That's not occurring in
the metropolitan area. There's
another program that doesn't quite work like
we'd like it to. With maybe
some help it could but it's called a
challenge grant program, right.
And I was interested this week by the ah
data sheet that was put up by the state. And it had all
the projects on one side and what they did. Then
the last column was local
investment. And all of the corporations
that had contributed to help do this, ah were in greater
Minnesota. All the metropolitan projects, because it's so much
easier to do there, hadn't
required that contribution. You know,
sometimes I think that if those
guys had to write checks to see this happen it
would probably get solved a lot
sooner.
But ah, you know we'll deal
with what we have to deal with and advance our cause and
tell our story. And I think it's compelling.
And hopefully will result in ah, greater economic
development opportunities in
greater Minnesota. Bethany: Tim, in your
conversations with the clients
in the areas that you represent
have you heard similar concerns
in terms of you know, needing more of
that middle…middle income
housing out there? Tim: Absolutely.
First of all I'd say um, when I have discussions in
communities about housing it's usually broader than just
the work force housing issue that we're describing.
It's usually we have a lot of
housing needs including the work force
housing need as we're
discussing it.
Um, one example I'd use is
Blackduck because we've been having a lot of
current conversation with them. But Anderson
Fabrics, major employer, key critical employer for
Blackduck. Um, not only wants to expand
they have been expanding but unfortunately their expansion
is taking place in Chicago. They're contracting for
employment because they don't have the housing to support an expanding work
force. Um, and like Dan suggested they're…they're
a willing partner in trying to make something happen but
they're dealing in a pretty
tough housing market at the same time. So, we need to find ways
including what we're talking about here to try to
help Blackduck meet those
needs. Bethany: As you talk about this
issue I'm assuming you've
talked with developers in terms of you
know what would it take to get more development happening.
How
do they, how do they respond? What is the problem? Dan: You
know our chief author in the
senate is from ah, Red Wing. Senator
Goggin. And when I first met him cause he's new, met him
this year, before I could even start going through the
proposal he said I know exactly
what you're talking about cause I've got a couple
developers in our area that
tell me they can build high end stuff.
And they can build ah, low end stuff or affordable
stuff cause there's a lot of subsidies.
What they
can't figure out how to do is this middle income stuff.
Because whether it's financing there's a whole lot of reasons
that seem to have broken the market. Ah, and I wish it was
different it just isn't. And that….so yeah
that's what it is. It's that kind of that gap of…of
ah what are the rents in the community.
How does this translate into a performer to build a new
apartment building? And it just isn't working out
very well in greater Minnesota.
You got some issues with you know, if you build it
you go get the appraisal and
you try to borrow money against it. The
appraisals don't match what
you're putting in like they would in the
metropolitan area. So you have
a problem with financing. So it's a whole lot
of problems. That's why we
think that we've got a sort of a market based
solution, a tax credit program.
That would help address that.
And we really believe that this doesn't have to be. You
know, I think we're going to be
in the affordable or low income business forever,
right? We're always going to
have to take care of people and we should. Ah, we hope that
after 4 or 5 years of a program like this that the
market starts to correct and
say, hey you know we can make money, we
can cash flow these projects in
greater Minnesota. So, we're hoping
this jump starts the market and doesn't need to become a
permanent program. Bethany: Do
you hear concerns, too, about I
mean you talked about Blackduck um, in terms of these smaller
or more rural cities that might just have one or two
key employers are they hesitant because
there's always the chance they
could pick up and relocate? Dan: It's no
question about it. Cause your you know if you think about it
if we say we all decide we're
done with this, we're going to go form a housing corporation.
We're going to go build
apartments and lease them out, right? If we go
to the Twin City metropolitan
area or Rochester or St.
Cloud, we're
not dependent on one or two manufacturers. But when you're
dependent on that one
manufacturer, boy you hope they're…you know
you've got…your eggs are in
that same basket as theirs. And there's, that is
another one of the concerns that developers have. That I
think is impeding some of the development. Tim: And it's not
only the developers, the
developers have to get financing. So you
have to think about it from
that stand point too. So there's
risk on both parts. [Ok] And the risk is
heightened if you um, run into that situation.
Bethany: In some ways it's gotta almost sound, almost
like a good problem for
communities to have. You have businesses that
want to invest that want to
grow in your your community. But they're
being hampered. That's what your hearing, that
communities are losing out on
potential opportunities. Dan:
No question. And they just don't have the tools
available to them that even in
the low income area, ah, say you know whatever
city Blackduck, Bemidji they could do a low income ah
TIF or tax income refinancing package
for I think up to 25 years to do a low income project.
Ah,
they can't do that for work force. And so there's a bill
that we support to help change that to allow communities maybe
more local tools. But that still
isn't going to be enough to I
think spur the kind of development
that is really required.
Bethany: Ok. Let's talk a little bit about
what it is that you would like
to see happen. Tell us a little bit about what the
proposal is that you've really
been trying to work with legislators on. Dan: Sure,
sure. Ah, it's a tax credit
proposal. It is a 40% tax credit up to a
million dollars per investor. Up to 2.8 million
dollars a project so we want to make sure there's
more than just one project
done. We don't want to see it get
gobbled up, ah you know one
project a year. But really the ask isn't that
large. It's 6.6 million this year. That…you know, that's
not going to fix the problem in
one year. Ah, but it would be a good
start. And so, what would happen is
the developer would apply for
the credit they'd get the credit, build a
project and then be able to
take advantage of that…of that tax
credit.
So we think it's a ah, a good way also a good
way to target this. Because sometimes there's been
over production of low income units. Ah, that…so you
have a higher vacancy rate there than you
might want to have. Where you
know, if you if you create that invest in,
or the incentive for the developer they're still
going to put this in an area
where it's needed. Otherwise, you know even with
that tax credit that's not
going to work out if there's not enough people there
that will lease these new
units. So, we think it….ah our proposal
will target this a little better as well.
Bethany: Are you finding
support? Dan: It varies. Ah, last year
we did make it into the senate tax bill, not the final tax
bill. It didn't get passed
anyway. But ah, after two years we
finally got into there. Ah, it varies. I think that ah,
you know we've got some work to do with
the number of new legislators.
Because I think they hear what we're talking
about.
And hear low income and
then see all those dollars that are going
and figure well, this is
already being taken care of. So, it is an education process
to get the new people up to speed on it. But ah, yeah
I'm optimistic that we're going to see
something happen this year.
There was a grant program that was started a
couple years ago. Ah, we supported it. We had…you
know, we thought there was
going to be some issues with it se…ah
surrounding the ah, concept of prevailing wage
requirements that came with it.
So if you look at the project in Roseau. I think
the…first year was like a 700 thousand dollar grant they
had to come back the next year
and put in almost I think, the same amount
to make the project happen. So
there are some, there are some issues I
think in that program that
could be worked out to make it work better. Ah, but we think
our tax credit proposal would actually result
in, um more units being built in a
quicker fashion.
Bethany: Is it fair to say that
when you're talking about this
you have to be really careful
to make sure that you want additional funds
versus like perhaps taking some away from low income
housing? You know what I'm saying? To make sure you can
get both? Tim: I'm pretty
passionate about that because frankly I think
from a state perspective um, we this is a tool that's
really really needed.
But um, we still have a really
big need for affordable housing. I
don't characterize it just as low income but it's low and
moderate income. But income assisted housing of some
level is still needed in at least the
region that I serve. It's pretty universal. And so
yeah, I do think it's we do want to be careful with
that because this is all about um…an additional
investment in housing in an area that has
not been addressed in the past. [Ok] Dan: Right. But
it shouldn't replace other things. I mean, you know, if
you think about it ah, probably the highest
priority would be homeless
people, right? I mean, it would be hard for me to say,
oh no don't do that and do
this, right? And so it is, it's an additive it's a need that we have.
But I
do think it's just a fight again because if you look at how the
state influences the housing market in the
metropolitan area. We talked
about the light rail, Vikings
stadium these things do create housing.
And we just don't have cause we're sort of located all
over, right. We don't have that
light rail but we do have a good
interstate system. We're trying to ah, you know improve that
all the time as well. And I should
point out we've got those good
roads and stuff it's important to use those.
Drive safely on those roads,
put that cell phone down when
you're driving and obey the
speed limits. So, I think that's important
too. [Absolutely] Plugging that
for a totally different reason.
[Laughing] Bethany: So, tell me I know
that some companies have really
gotten kind of creative in terms of how
they're going to stay, they don't want to leave
these communities.
I think is
there one that's like busing people an hour or so to
try to to keep their employees going,
and so. You know have you heard from
companies that they really do
want to be in rural Minnesota? Tim: Um, I
was just at a board meeting last night and one of my
commissioners lives in Shevlin and he was talking about people
in his community that are busing um, up to Thief River
Falls and working at Digi-Key. And um, you know it's pretty successful and people
are willing to do that because
it's a it's a good job opportunity and
there's no housing available
close by.
So they're…they want to be in
their community anyway but they don't really have an
opportunity to move because
there's no housing anyway. Bethany:
There's just no opportunities
for them. Dan: Yeah, there's companies in southwestern part
of the state, too, that are
running their own transit systems to bring people
to work. Mayo Clinic in fact does one. They run their
own buses around that area to make sure they get people to
work. But yeah, that's how I'm not gonna say desperate,
but I mean if they don't want
to do that right they'd rather be spending
their time and resources
improving their business and selling more product and
employing more people. But part
of that for some of these companies has been ah,
transit systems.
And again that's different then the
metropolitan area. And so, again we're not trying to take
anything away from them. We're
just trying to say we…we've got different needs
and they need to be addressed.
Bethany: Each community has it's own unique needs I'm sure
as you guys hear repeatedly.
[Yeah] Dan: And I think Tim was right,
that it depends on where you go it's a different mix. Some
areas need a lot of both. Some areas need more
of affordable than others. Some people say,
hey we've got plenty of
affordable but this middle income. So I
don't think it's a cookie cutter you know, I think every town is
almost different. [Right] There's not a one size fits all
solution. Bethany: Do you find that there's communities that
exist that have some housing available it's just not what
they need? So like, the low
income housing for example, they could
live there but they don't meet
those income requirements? Dan: Yeah,
I can't speak specifically for
this area. I live in Albert Lea
and you know one way…we hear a
lot from the school district.
That's this is a problem and ah, I know a guy that
manages a section 8 building.
Nice building down by the lake.
And he can always tell when the
new teachers are in town because there's a
knock on the door [knocks on
table] hey, can you sign me up right? Oh, great
what do you do? He said, well took a job at the school
district. Oh yeah, sorry you
make too much money. So those units sit empty. You
know, it's not a high rate but there's always empty
units there. They sit empty.
Where you know you got these other
people saying, well maybe I
don't want to move to this
town. Maybe I want to go to the cities
because I can live in a you know, a better apartment.
Ah, and that is happening. It's a strange deal. But it is
happening. I think you know, you're going to see
more and more school districts
start to talk about this. Which is really ah, different than
what you think. I mean, the mind set is underpaid,
somehow factory workers you know, this
nefarious evil.
And it really isn't that. It's
really people that are making a
decent wage but they also want a decent
place to live. And who
wouldn't, what's wrong with
that? Bethany: Let's talk about some
of the tools that do exist.
You've referenced TIF earlier in terms
of the way that it can be used
to develop certain types of housing. Is
TIF not an option for a housing development such as
this? Dan: Not for, not for
market rate housing. It is for low
income. But the legislature restricts the…you know, which
always bothers me. You know it
seems like in full disclosure, I'm a
former state legislator. When we run for election right,
we're all in favor of local
control and it seems like too many of us we
get to St. Paul and not want to
control the local. So they do not let cities
ah…we joined with the league of cities
trying to change that. The
coalitions a partner in it. Trying to make sure that
we could use TIF but in the cities that I've talked to,
they're going to use it.
No question about it. But it isn't
going to be enough in and of itself. So I think that would
be a needed tool. And it's
local dollars there are no state dollars in
ah, TIF program. So, you know why St. Paul restricts
it that way is beyond me. I think our communities are
responsible ah, if the city council says hey, this
is what we want to do and this
is..this makes sense for our community.
I have no idea why the state's
standing in the way but that's a tough sell in St.
Paul. And why is it a tough sell is because I think
some of the abuses that people
have seen and they've occurred in the
metropolitan area.
Well, don't
ring us up for that you know? In fact, one ah,
senator who will go unnamed but this particular
senator was originally against TIF for anybody but
then kind of moderated their position and said you
know, I guess this does make
sense in the metro area. Cause you kind of sit down with them
have that conversation about,
it's a little different game out here. Again,
it's not saying it's better,
worse or anything it's just
different. And so you might
need different tools in the metropolitan area, they've got
different tools. We may need some different tools,
there's nothing wrong with
that. Bethany: Is that a big
part of your process right now?
Trying to educate in terms of
the problem for rural or for metro
based legislators? Dan: Absolutely. And even
the….even the new greater Minnesota legislators. Cause
for some of them you know you're learning so many things.
There's LGA, other issues are flying at you, transportation
what do all of these things
mean? And you've got to try to figure
this out and then somebody's
over here talking about housing.
But you
know we're spending all this
money over here. So yeah, there's an education
piece to it. It's a…that's why we're there. And
ah…. Tim: That's one of the reasons
like in, um that we're really interested in being part
of the partnership is that we
don't have the ability to be spending
time in St. Paul. Um, you know we're 4 hours
away. Um, and so it's just difficult
and being a member of the
partnership allows us to be
part of a voice that's going to be
heard. Cause we don't
necessarily think individually we're going
to be heard very loudly at
least. And so it's been a good thing
for us to be a member of a group of ah, communities
throughout the state that are engaged in
these dialogues and willing to provide some leadership to
try to get things done. Dan: The Center for Rural
Policy they were in St.
Peter, they came out
with a report about 4 years ago
who speaks for greater Minnesota at the
capitol on these issues. And at
the end of the day the report said,
nobody. Ah, they also didn't
think anybody could do it. That it would be
too hard to do, what we're
doing. But we don't believe
that. We think we can get it done. But one
thing they noted in that was that you know, metropolitan
area has their own
organizations but also the state wide
organizations and not again intentionally but are picking
up a metropolitan feel. And Tim
hit on one of the reasons, right?
There's one organization that
has a meeting right before session
to put their priorities together it's an afternoon, ah like a
Friday afternoon typically in St. Paul. You don't get
people driving 4 or 5 hours to go down for a 3 hour
meeting.
Right, so who's in the
room? Tends to be and I've been
there, ah it tends to be people if you do the dot and
then draw the area, unless there's a board member, it's
people that are within 75 miles of the metropolitan area,
right? And that's a state wide
organization. But that's who's there at the
meeting and then that's what
their ah, the priorities being to
pick up that metropolitan feel even though it's unintentional.
And that's what that Center for
Rural Policy report talked about. Was
that you know, somebody needs to be out there talking about
hey don't forget us. You know
again it isn't…it isn't we're
trying to take anything away
from them we're just trying to
say hey ah cause I don't think people
in the metropolitan area wake
up in the morning and say boy
let's put the screws to those guys up in
Bemidji or Dorman, lets go you know make things
hard for them.
It's just not
top of mind cause they've got their
own stuff they're dealing with.
It's just important, it's important that
greater Minnesota have that
voice at the capitol on a consistent
basis. Bethany: Do you have any time any idea in terms of what
kind of number of units could be beneficial
statewide? I mean, has there
been any research into actual figures, in terms
of the stats in terms of how
much could be used? Dan: I think
Minnesota housing finance would
say I should have brought the
brochure but as I recall ah, it's about 6,000 units. You
could right now I mean today.
Bethany: That
they could fill them today if
they were constructed. Dan: If they were
constructed. So I mean there is
a big…that's why in one of the committees this
week, ah people were like well why don't you do this as
well? Why don't you this as
well? Trying to help the bill, right? Well just
do some low or do some ah single family home stuff. And
another representative pointed
out, it's only 6 million dollars a year, it's not…you
know, this isn't going to solve all housing issues. You
know if you think of the scale
we're talking about 6 million a year versus
100 million a year in low
income.
Again, that's not bad. I'm not
saying take that money I'm just
saying you think of the scale, ah we
can't solve the…that at 100 million
dollars a year we're going to
have a hard time you know making a big dent in
it at even 6 million dollars a year. The DEED program I
referenced earlier is only 2
million dollars a year and while nice, it just isn't
enough to really bend that curve very
much. Bethany: Is the lag time concerning then, in a way? You
know that the need is here now and even if you got funds
yet this year it's going to
take, what? 2 years to get them constructed
and operational? Dan: Yeah, the nice thing and one reason
you know that we're trying to ah establish this program within
DEED or the Department of
Employment and Economic Development.
The
other, the big housing players Minnesota finance agency and
because of the nature of their programs they've got
federal tax credits and so much
more complicated process. But we
were at a meeting in Thief
River Falls with the League of
Minnesota Cities and Minnesota
Chamber trying to understand the issue, get more
information. And one of the
cities talked about when they did an MFHA project
it was a 2 year process the DEED grant program they
were able to get it spun around in less than a year. So that's
one reason why we want to work
with DEED cause we think that this, we look at this
economic development not you know low income housing and
so DEED is seems to be much more responsive. That's
not a criticism, hey I better
throw that in there so I don't get a bunch
of angry people. It's just
different. And it's a different need and
ah so hopefully it's not two
years.
Bethany: Are you feeling kind
of confident at all? I mean do you feel like there might be
a chance of success yet this
year? Dan: I do. I do. I don't know…ah, you
know I hope it's the whole 6
million that I don't feel as confident
about. But I think we're going to see some action. You
know we've seen growth each
year that we've tried. This first year we
couldn't get any traction. Next
thing you know we're in the
senate tax bill.
So hopefully this is
the year that we're able to push it over that end line. And
actually get it signed into
law. Bethany: Well I want to thank
you both for joining me today um thank you for tuning in. If
you'd like to learn more about
the Greater Minnesota Partnership or this issue I
encourage you to visit the website on the bottom of the
screen. Thank you. Join me next
time. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪.