And I proceed to
.
with an expert colleague, eMobility Advisors,.
which is actually, our goal is to work.
full time on policy to advertise transportation.
and also electrification throughout the board. For this reason the E3 PowerPoint.
style, however the brand-new title. And I believe the other factor.
this is in E3 PowerPoint layout, I'' ll reference. is simply a great deal'of what I ' m going to. present to you today is distilled from current.
introduction, then provide a little history on.
the electrical energy sector, fast guide on market.
and regulative context. I want to talk concerning.
some of the major themes across energies and also states,.
a few of things that actually, the biggest.
concerns that they'' re all thinking of. And afterwards I want.
to enter into three– pardon me, 5 specific.
locations which are really prominent. As well as I'' ll talk a. bit regarding where states are coming.
together and also where they'' re merging on those points. The next concern–.
Oh, OK, all. Electrical energies.
and also car manufacturers have actually traditionally existed in.
completely different globes. The electrification.
of transportation is really bringing.
them together. And I believe they'' re. something of a strange pair. So let me lay some foundation.
to obtain to the point where you can, I.
believe, see that. Point to understand.
about electrical utilities in the USA is that.
there are a great deal of them.There are something like. close to 3,000 of them.
They drop right into 3 classifications. Investor-owned, so.
their supply, they'' re traded on publicly. traded business. Openly had, which are.
generally owned and run by a city or a county, so like.
Austin, Texas, Seattle, LA, Sacramento, are examples of.
big openly owned energies, yet there'' s a whole lot. of youngsters.
And afterwards there ' s additionally. a great deal of cooperatives.
168 versus virtually 3,000 public ones. That tiny component of– tiny portion that ' s. investor-owned actually accounts for many.
The various other thing is simply to provide. The bottom.
As well as this is kind of old. I see it ' s from 2012. There'' s been some a lot more. mergers given that after that. The major point to keep in mind.
is that two of the California energies, Pacific Gas as well as.
Electric, PG&E, and Edison International, which is the.
holding firm for Southern The golden state Edison, they'' re. amongst the top two utilities in the nation. And also if you in fact look.
at, type of different away the holding companies or.
some of the various other ventures that are sometimes.
covered up in them, PG&E as well as Edison are possibly.
still the largest energies in the US. That'' s essential. When we think concerning California, to assume regarding. So very balkanized market,.
but a great deal of the cash is in the large IOUs. They generally offer the.
big populated areas.So car manufacturers
. Actually various.
sort of sector. Extremely affordable.
consumer product. Substantial. These are all–.
the large car manufacturers are all global business. 2019, total revenue.
for the industry was over a trillion dollars. , if you look at the market.
.
cap for the top 10 firms led by Toyota as well as VW, it'' s massive. 200 billion for Toyota,
. 80 billion for VW. And if you check out a.
utility, their market cap is commonly rather.
a bit smaller sized. Specifically a great deal of the ones.
on this chart on the right are, once more, they'' re. holding companies, so there are several.
energies in there. If you go, like I believe.
the very first one that'' s really just a single utility is
. Consolidated Edison, which offers in New york city City area. And afterwards PG&E. Since April last year, about.
a year earlier, their market cap was $27 million for
. Con Ed, 22 million for PG&E. , if you.
.
comply with the news, you understand that great deals of points.
have actually taken place that have set you back PG&E ' s stock value to go down.So I keep in mind
below that.
their highest market cap considering that 2006 was 35 million. So one utility, one big energy.
has about the exact same market cap as a good-sized.
car manufacturer, as well as is dwarfed by the biggest one. And the profits is additionally, if.
you take a look at like Toyota'' s 2019 [FAINT] of $172 billion. Compare that to PG&E,.
so about $17 billion. Again, order of.
size distinction. So just to place them.
in point of view. The various other thing that'' s– now, I ' ll come back to what. the importance of several of those things are. Simply birth that in mind. So IOUs, Investor.
Possessed Utilities, are controlled at.
the state level. That resembles the nature of.
the federalism for the power industry is that really most.
of the guideline on all the vital things.
takes place at the state level. The primary exception.
is interstate business, which mainly suggests.
local electrical power markets like PJM in the.
mid-Atlantic area, as well as interstate transmission. Truly, most other facets.
of IOUs, operation, pricing, et cetera are managed.
at the state degree by entities with various.
names, but commonly called utility compensations or.
Public solution commissions.In most states.
That ' s just how it functions. in The golden state.
There are a number of states,.
Our following door neighbor Arizona,.
where they'' re chosen. And also that can lead to some.
really peculiar things happening. And also if anybody bears in mind, I'' ll. tell you regarding one in the&Q&A after the workshop in.
the pupil discussion. EPA controls smokestacks,.
PUCs manage rather a lot whatever else. So it'' s actually these. investor-owned energies are local monopolies. What they have a syndicate.
over depends upon whether they'' re in what ' s known as. a restructured state where they ' re still totally. up and down integrated and also they manage all facets.
of generation, transmission, as well as circulation of electrical energy. However anyway,.
they'' re local monopolies and also they'' re controlled
by. these state authorities. OEMs, automakers, originally.
equipment producers or OEMs, are managed.
generally at the federal degree, with some delegation.
to the states. That can appear confusing.
As well as I'' ll describe why.So the Federal Clean Air. Act is the main authority
for tailpipe emissionsDischarges
And also commonly that'' s. been the gas mileage standards established by the US EPA and also the.
National Freeway Security Website Traffic Administration. And afterwards I believe the enforcement.
is largely approximately the states. The Clean Air Act.
granted The golden state special power to set its own stricter.
tailpipe requirements when it was passed back in the very early '' 70s. And also the factor for that is that.
because of decades of air quality concerns in Southern California,.
our state was already controling exhausts.
from automobiles, and also normally attempting to.
address pollution problems.And so The golden state had an. exception took for it that allowed it to continue to.
have its very own stricter requirements in order to try to fulfill– stricter standards for automobiles.
as well as various other things in order to meet the federal requirements.
for numerous contaminants like dioxin particulate.
issue and so forth etc. The other fascinating point.
about the Clean Air Act is that, I believe.
it'' s area 177, allows various other states to take on. The golden state ' s regulations. Which has happened.
for a long time with its just conventional.
tailpipe discharges requirements for, again, things like NOx. Yet because California began up.
with its Zero-Emission Car program 20 plus years.
earlier, that has actually actually been promoting.
car manufacturers to make and offer both battery electric.
and also gas cell vehicles.To date– really, I. believe this is wrong.
I believe 10 various other states have. taken on the Zero-Emission Lorry program, because. Colorado simply joined in 2015.
And both Minnesota and. New Mexico get on the method.
So the ZEV states. quantity to something
like a third of the United States. market for car manufacturers.
And also I assume it ' s secure to say. Here they are, they'' re. They'' re selling.
And also there ' s 2 requirements,. one at the state level, and one at the government level. As well as when the Trump. administration came in, as well as California and also the. feds had actually achieved– had actually converged at the. time that, during when Head of state Obama was in office. But they had merged on.
some quite rigorous gas mileage slash CO2 requirements,.
tailpipe criteria. As Well As when President Trump was.
elected, a few of the automakers mosted likely to him as well as claimed,.
you recognize, we actually want that you would not– that you can sort of.
reduce this whole thing down.And he primarily claimed,. oh boy will certainly I ever before.
As well as he has truly tried. California ' s authority to establish its very own requirements completely. They ' re all off.
Due to the fact that now they. have 2 standards
and they have actually a.
great deal of lawsuits before it obtains arranged out. 2 various sectors,.
one regional monopoly is under state.
guidance, primarily type of financial regulation. The various other federally controlled.
with this interesting carve out for The golden state.
as well as international enterprises. Now they'' re coming with each other. The California No.
Discharges Vehicle program, which is to day generally.
been applied in California, it is now really being.
gotten in other states and implemented proactively.
in other states.Again, that ' s
something if'.
you would like to know concerning it I can inform you later on. Now we have this.
convergence of these 2 historically different and.
extremely distinct markets. Therefore we have.
ladies and individuals that help car manufacturers resting.
in spaces like the one in the top left, which is.
the amphitheater at the CPUC, because suddenly the CPUC.
as well as other civil service compensations, specifically.
in the ZEV states, are actually vital.
locations for them. Due to the fact that those– the.
utilities at a minimum have to strengthen their.
distribution systems in order to offer what will over time.
be a rather considerable tons. As well as lots of utilities as well as a great deal.
of ecological advocates are excitedly banging.
on the door stating, we want to build not.
simply the infrastructure, the distribution infrastructure,.
We would certainly also such as to, in several circumstances we would.
like to possess as well as operate charging terminals. Due to the fact that energies, the.
other point that'' s essential regarding them is while.
automakers earn money by selling cars, and also also.
Lending cash individuals to purchase cars and trucks, lending.
cash to individuals to purchase cars, energies make money by.
releasing infrastructure. And after that they earn money a.
return on their infrastructure.So they such as building. more infrastructure.
And additionally, what. they also such as is to be near to.
their customers and to be viewed as doing.
points that are environment-friendly, specifically in states.
like the ZEV states. And so for every one of.
those factors, we'' ve had a variety of utilities come.
ahead to their commissions and claim, we it like to own.
as well as operate billing terminals, or we wish to be entailed.
in this in some way.And I wear
' t mean to make.
this sound wicked. I suggest, these are just.
And also there'' s a whole lot of excellent. As well as lots of people.
who just appreciate, this is a new electrical tons,.
as well as it'' s our job to offer it, as well as we'require to function out. how we ' re going to do it. Now this is being functioned out.
As well as somewhat in. almost every state currently'.
With 3 states I ' m. mosting likely to speak about, mosting likely to
zero in on, actually.
being in the vanguard.And this is just a gigantic.
migraine for, oh yes. Below they are due to the fact that once more. They'' re substantial global business. And also it was negative.
enough that they needed to deal with like the.
feds versus the ZEV states in the US. And currently they'' ve got 50 states.
that are each kind of deciding, well, we'' re going
to. make a decision for ourselves how we should utilize our electrical.
energies to support transport as well as.
electrification. To ensure that is– to ensure that'' s. the stage, phase is set. The states I'' m going to speak.
about, I'' m mosting likely to absolutely no in on, are our residence state of.
California, and after that New York State, which.
is traditionally also a genuine bellwether.
state for regulation.And after that Hawaii,
. which has actually truly arised in the. last several years as a very intriguing.
lab for power plan, and also has actually type of been a.
leader in some regards. So just extremely rapidly,.
the technique– we started on this.
When the initial Leafs as well as, in 2009 in California.
Volts and Tesla Model Ses were heading our way. And the payment.
and also the utilities comprehended that we needed to.
begin doing some points to suit that lots. As well as sort of the prevailing.
view that truly kind of, I would claim, governed.
what took place at the CPUC to the level.
that you could also claim it was type of a.
approach, was essentially let a thousand blossoms flower. Utilities are mosting likely to.
involved us with concepts. We need to let them.
try things out. Due to the fact that some, we had pilots that– I call them pilots.
of them were like $100 million, which is not a pilot in really,.
I believe, anyone'' s book.And consequently, we had San. Diego Gas & & Electric wishing to have and also operate, charging.
facilities, you understand, the entire nine lawns. We had a various model.
from Southern The Golden State Edison in the Los Angeles area. There was a great deal of lawsuits. And also now, 10 years.
on, the commission has actually launched a large.
docket that they'' re calling the DRIVE.
OIR, where they'' re attempting to work out sort of.
a comprehensive framework that they'' re calling the.
transport electrification framework. As well as that would certainly finish in a.
direction then to the energies to bring them plans. I'' ll just state briefly, there.
was a stakeholder mutiny when this 200-page draft,.
TEF as it'' s called, came out.And they
said, this.
is method way too much job. By the time this all.
They'' re kind of. New York, that.
constructing that looks like it ought to be in.
Moscow or maybe Stalingrad, is in fact the headquarters of.
the New York Public Utilities. Or it'' s anyhow, it ' s on. the Capitol Shopping Center in Albany. It ' s truly a scary. looking area. As well as they ' ve only come with it.
from a a lot more leading down sight, where it'' s like– you understand, they ' ve type. of told the energies to try some stuff. After that they said,.
we'' re going to tell you what we want you to do. We'' re mosting likely to inform you what.
role we'' re going to have. So they had to be very.
They had a few workshops.
price as well as advantages. As well as after that they place.
out a white paper in which they said, OK, this.
is how we think it ought to be. Below'' s our version. And after that the 3rd.
one is Hawaii, where for a number of years currently, the.
Hawaiian payment have really been saying to.
the utility, HECO, like primarily they'' ve produced.
a decision, perhaps like 7, ten years earlier when solar was.
initially ending up being a huge thing. And also just said,.
pay attention, you individuals, you are simply from the last century. Points are mosting likely to.
This is just how we'' re. You ' re going to be a lot more. And then they hammered on.
them numerous more times.And they allow HECO do. a little around EV billing stations. They in fact did a truly cool. pilot with Nissan at one point
. When they came. back for more, and this
was what I would certainly call a. real pilot, extremely small.
When they came back for even more,. the compensation said, no. That ' s sufficient. We want to see your plan. We want you to go do. stakeholder outreach,
as well as we want you. to come back with an extensive electrification. tactical roadmap that sets out your priorities for the. near-term, the mid-term, and also the long-lasting,. Up to 10 years, across all the potentially. electrifiable technologies.And so I had the privilege to. work with that when I was at E3,
as well as the file is readily available. , if you go to E3 ' s website or HECO ' s. And I believe it still.. really kind of established the standard for what would certainly. these strategies resemble.
Anyway, so 3 of. the states, as well as so we '
ll just type of follow. them through.As you believe regarding a power.
I mean, a great deal of other things. It permits the utility to
collect. That ' s at'its core, that'' s. actually what they do.
and a lot of the other ZEV states, regulatory authorities.
and also energies have been pushed into.
solution to support social as well as ecological objectives. And none a lot more– and also.
many of these kind of come under the heading of what.
we call market improvement. So the suggestion of taking a.
fairly new and not yet business technology, like.
in the last decade renewable power, as well as in the.
present and also coming decade, electrical lorries. You recognize, transforming.
the market for those to make them completely.
business, as well as pump priming. That'' s become a core part.
of the objective, certainly of the California.
payment, and I think it'' s reasonable to state. that the Hawaii compensation, and to a big extent the New.
York commission understand– see themselves the same way.So they desire market.
change. They intend to sustain.
their states, EV adoption and greenhouse gas.
reduction goals. For certain they respect prices. Yet the various other point.
they actually respect when they'' re type of. setting the regulations for that reaches do what and just how much.
the rate payers spend for, is they additionally want.
competitors as well as innovation. As well as they'' re mindful.
that the utility is a regulated syndicate,.
that it has essentially assured capital healing. As well as they have to.
somehow play this, like do this fragile.
balancing act to produce a having fun field in.
which new participants offering, for instance, charging.
services can can be found in as well as take organization.
versions in a sector that truly has no all-natural.
syndicate attributes. You can'' t truly state that EV. billing is an all-natural syndicate like the way that you recognize the.
customers section of the utility is. So what they'' re attempting.
to equilibrium is like, well, if we have the utility do.
it, they can go really quickly, and we can actually deploy a.
lot of charging infrastructure, as well as helps sell a whole lot of cars.But after that possibly
we.
would off these brand-new participants.
that are probably a lot more innovative than the energies. Really a whole lot of my work,.
as well as just type of thought that I'' ve corrected. the last one decade, has actually actually been around.
this core inquiry. Therefore we'' re going.
to see how that'' s played out in various states. So the last thing I want to.
say is if you kind of think of the marketplace.
makeover difficulty of EVs from the perspective.
of the automobile sector, of the environmental advocates,.
of typically the more comprehensive neighborhood that want.
to see EVs adopted, we kind of came.
to the verdict, once more, in the job that we did.
with utilities and also regulatory authorities at E3, is that it.
really makes feeling to structure that conversation.
around what are the fostering obstacles to EVs.And there have been research study after. study, a great deal of excellent job out of ICCT in San Francisco. Absolutely not.
limited to them. Surveys and.
researches on variables that stand in the method.
of individuals buying cars. And also typically, they.
no in on individuals just wear'' t understand that much.
regarding EVs, and also they'' re stressed that they can'' t. cost, that there ' s not sufficient billing infrastructure. Array anxiousness. As well as today, they still price.
more than various other cars. As well as there are some various other points. And after that from the.
energy point of view, there'' s additionally this. question of just how do we incorporate this large.
new tons into our grid, in particular our.
circulation grid, where a billing EV can.
usage as much electrical power under certain scenarios.
as a home does today. As well as so there'' s that. inquiry for them.
And after that there ' s. the various other inquiry. The majority of autos aren'' t driving.
people to drive and bill their cars in such a way that'' s. helpful to the grid, and also particularly assists.
us take in solar power? We did a lot of operate at.
E3 on this, I'' ll mention.So when you think of what.
the energy'' s function will be, there are actually three.
models, although there are four are revealed right here. So model number one.
is simply primarily, this is a tons like.
any type of other tons. It'' s much like a. new community. The utility'' s task. is to just supply the service links. So all the stuff.
by itself system. The cables, the service drop, the.
transformer, approximately the meter. That'' s their task, as well as that.
obtains recouped via rates. And everything else,.
that'' s up to the customer.So that'' s, like I claimed,
. that ' s company as common. On the opposite.
end of the range is what some.
energies have actually asked their commissioners to allow them.
do, which is complete ownership.
The other point that'' s– now, I ' ll come back to what. It'' s truly these. Or it'' s anyhow, it ' s on. It'' s just like a. new neighborhood. The utility'' s task.They generally desire to be– they want to both
do the upgrade, and afterwards they wish to use some
kind of turnkey or concierge service as well as do every little thing on
the client side of the meter too, including
possessing as well as operating the billing framework. And also after that instance
number two is truly the in-between instance, which
is what'' s described as a make all set, where the energy does the upgrade on its side of the meter. And after that it deals with kind of the wiring and whatever else on the consumer side of the meter up to the billing terminal. The client possesses the charging station and also has a different relationship with some kind of 3rd party business, like ChargePoint, or EVgo.So those
are the versions. And a great deal of the fight around what the energy'' s role should be and just how much ratepayer money should be invested in EV charging actually sort of circles around this concern of which of these duties does the utility play. Just how has it worked out in our 3 states? So once more, in California, we'' ve. let a thousand flowers blossom, so we'' ve attempted all the models.So Southern The golden state, which.
is imagined on the right, that'' s a San
Diego gas and. electric center, they persuaded the commission.
to allow them do this, to own as well as run a great deal.
of charging infrastructure, primarily in work environments.
and also multi-family real estate in exchange for piloting.
an extremely fascinating time-dependent tariff.
design, which is really developed to make use of EVs to.
incorporate solar energy, because they have much more.
solar on their system than any one of the other energies. So at the other end.
of the spectrum, Southern California Edison.
entered into the compensation right from the start.
as well as stated, you understand, we just actually mainly.
wished to do [FAINT].
And we believe that will certainly–.
we believe that will function. PG&E concerned the
. payment and also stated, we will wish to do whatever. And also the payment said, no. You can'' t. And in the long run, they finished. up getting a mainly make readies accepted, with some.
exemptions for deprived neighborhoods– that'' s a DAC– as well as multi-unit houses,.
which have proved to be extremely difficult to serve. And afterwards there'' s some pilots. As well as there has not been a.
great deal of utility money yet– I believe PG&E is the exemption,.
It'' s really largely a make-ready that
. has entered into DC quick charging, due to the fact that there'' s. cap as well as profession income and also VW under the. settlement arrangement, has been spending all.
the cash on that.So kind
of a combination.
in California. I assume in this, you understand,.
this docket I stated in the past, the plan docket.
that'' s occurring currently, they'' re actually sort of recognizing. that nobody believes that it ' s wrong to do make-readies.
Or everyone assumes it ' s. penalty to do make-readies.
So then it ' s really. a lot more regarding what are the conditions in which. it ' s appropriate for energies to do more.
New york city, extremely various. kettle of fish than The golden state. Totally restructured state.
So the utilities are. really mainly distribution companies.New York,
it'' s the house. of'the stock market.
It ' s simply, it ' s an extremely
. market-oriented state. And also the payment personnel,. under the guidance of the chair of the New york city. Civil service Payment wrote this white paper I. discussed, and also issued it in January. And they essentially.
claim, look, there'' s no factor for utilities to
be. in the billing framework business or billing. service company whatsoever. And also we don'' t desire them in it.
And we assume the. make-ready design is fine.
And we understand that in. rural upstate areas of New york city it'' s mosting likely to be challenging. to release the network of DC quick battery chargers that'' s needed.
to give people the variety confidence to, claim,.
It ' s also the case that New York.
The New York City Power. Authority gets a great deal of
earnings from the large. hydro plants like at Niagara drops. As well as they ' ve been investing some. cash on DC quick charging too.
That ' s kind of another. reason that the utilities don ' t always'need.
to be touched for that.Hawaii, when
we composed.
When we assisted HECO create their, our plan for.
transport tactical strategy, they really desired to.
And the means we.
described it is we intend to have all this creative.
damage in the charging industry, and you understand whole lots.
of development and competition. But we don'' t want people. to ever really feel like they'' re going to be stranded. So HECO must possess.
a critical backbone. When the compensation.
took a look at this, they claimed, well, we put on'' t. truly understand what that means. We told HECO to.
go employ a consultant to come up with a container as well as put.
it as a browse road record, and also you can review it. I did not find it.
all that engaging. As well as I'' m unsure the. commission did either, since they then provided. yet an additional choice, as well as they claimed,.
appearance, allow'' s just not talk regarding that crucial.
backbone point for now.Just go just to
make-readies.
and work with the buses, due to the fact that the significant cities,.
especially Oahu, intend to begin.
impressive buses. That'' s kind of what ' s. gone on in Hawaii. I would certainly state in.
general the fad is towards that. the make-ready is coming to be the primary model. It really gets the energy.
mostly out of business of being a billing.
provider. As well as the exemptions are going.
to be around inclusiveness for disadvantaged neighborhoods.
and entering into places like multifamily.
real estate, where it'' s simply a lot harder to jack.
neighborhood city federal government. So you see Los Angeles.
Department of Water and Power being a lot extra proactive. And additionally see this to some.
level in the southeast, where compensations tend to be extra.
indulgent of what utilities desire to do. Let me chat regarding,.
type of promptly go with a few of the.
other key considerations for commissioners. California national politics are.
such that it'' s actually, actually vital to choice. makers in Sacramento, to the legislature.
particularly, and quite on carbohydrate'' s. radar, the Air Top Quality Board, that the rollout of electrical.
automobiles can not simply benefit the rich people who.
actually purchase brand-new autos. We see, specifically.
in California as well as these large.
100-plus– you understand, multi-million-dollar choices.
licensing municipality financial investment as well as charging.
framework. There are mosting likely to be.
percents therein, that you have to put this much.
in disadvantaged areas, and also that much in– like at least this much.
in multi-family housing.And PG&E has a. program
that they ' re– a new program where they'' re. mosting likely to in fact do kind'of like a turnkey service for reduced. to moderate revenue customers.
And lots of people in reduced and also. And so it ' s really not a smart. The other point of.
view is like, look, allow ' s simply concentrate on tidying up the. discharges of the vehicles that go through those neighborhoods.
and are situated near to them.So the ports, large. business fleets, highways.
And also so that ' s– the New. York whitepaper states that explicitly, like we ' re.
not mosting likely to assign. We ' re not mosting likely to inform them.
to go get these things integrated in low-income neighborhoods. We ' re going to concentrate on cleaning. up'trucking and transit.
As well as I suggest, I will certainly say,. The golden state is doing both.
I indicate, we lead the. country in terms of what we make with ports and also transportation. We have a kind. of I ' m mosting likely to
have'one of every little thing on. the menu, or perhaps even numerous of everything. on the menu strategy.
However I assume the secret. point is that a few of these even more. market-oriented states, once again, don ' t see it as. making that much feeling to put infrastructure in. low-income areas.
I assume the. I indicate, when you look. And that'' s why CARB has actually.
program, and they currently call it the Advanced.
Clean Transit Policy. And also whatever is an.
Advanced Clean Vehicle, Advanced Clean Truck policy. So we will certainly see a whole lot more action.
on that particular in all the states. The thinking is by far the.
most advanced in California. I desire to chat regarding two.
final points actually swiftly, in the last five.
minutes, since I desire to have some room for Q&A. Cost advantage analysis. This is something.
that has been honed to an extremely great.
point over decades at commissions like the ones.
in California and New York. And brand-new investments,.
In power effectiveness or the.
decision concerning needs to we construct this nuclear power plant,.
or do the storage space point, they undergo the expense.
benefit analysis wringer.There ' s been a large. discussion about must we be applying price. benefit evaluation to transportational. electrification financial investments that energies are making. with their clients ' cash. And San Diego Gas and also. Electric commissioned E3
to do a cost price.
And also I don ' t believe throw. it'in the round documents, yet no one looked.
at the commission. They simply type of steamed in advance. They place'' t really anxious.
regarding cost effectiveness at all, since.
their view is, appearance, this is market transformation.We ' re at the very early
. phase of this market.
Why would we expect. On the various other hand, John Rhodes,.
price payers ' bucks carefully. And also I do believe the majority of. commissioners, consisting of all the ones in California. feel by doing this also. However they leaven that.
And also so he wants to be. The Hawaii strategy consists of. Once more, it wasn ' t. really something that was determinative.
for their compensation. Once again, the dollars.
have actually not actually allowed in any state yet,.
besides California. As well as some states have.
begun to say, OK, when you return to us energy.
with$ 100 million program or something like that,.
You ' re actually going to have to prove that.
EVs, but for the general body of price payers as well.And the factor that it.
recovering those repaired costs over more kilowatt hrs sales.
These are 2. charts I took out of the Hawaiian electric plan. What they reveal is that from.
It ' s cheaper. That ' s obtaining.
Well, the individuals who. The various other question.
As well as what we discovered in. Hawaii was that it was even more than what they.
The question that ' s. not being asked is– although we did a. little bit in New York. The question that'' s not. Last point I desire.
When there ' s an excess of solar power, hours. There ' s a whole lot of.
various means that you can do that with rates. There'have been a whole lot of. innovative prices explore around the
US. I pointed out the. one that San Diego attempted that ' s a time differing price. that especially urges billing at times of day. when there ' s surplus solar.New York had a pilot with a. truly interesting business called FleetCarma, teamed up.
with Disadvantage Ed, and they did– they piloted a technique that.
primarily simply paid people a reward if they went the entire.
month without ever charging throughout the on peak hrs.
Hawaii is, once more, at the. instructions of their compensation, as well as even as we talk,.
creating EV prices that are going to have the exact same,.
I think the very same goals that especially the.
SDG&E rates to utilize their excess solar power.
When asked by clients when.
And also the thing that.
we liked concerning it was that it ' s a three-part rate.So there
is a client.
billed, much like generally what you bill, pay every.
month to be attached and have a bill published and sent to you. After that there'' s kind. of a cost that ' s related to sort of the.
total dimension of your footprint on the grid and also that.
If you use– if you spread your lots, can go down.
out, also it out some. And afterwards the actually.
interesting thing on there was the marginal expense.
value-based charge which differs by hour. They took the California.
ISO day ahead rates. And they claimed, OK, tomorrow is.
mosting likely to be a high solar day, so the rate is going to be.
actually low in the mid-day, as well as we'' re mosting likely to reveal that. to the customer in the hopes that they will choose.
to bill then.So really intriguing instance. Once again, delighted to give. info on every one of these.
I will just say.
Which ' s since. they choose'out the days where it'' s most useful.
to have someone relocate their charging around. So they offer a whole lot.
more worth to the grid. Therefore that'' s why we constantly. sustained those rates. That is all I have to
. state that I have time to state. And also I'' m pleased to.
take your concerns. JOHN WEYANT: Great. Many thanks extremely a lot, Nancy. That was a terrific.
I'' m going to
try attempt summarizeSum up There are several.
concerns that sort of access simply probably seeing.
you as one of the world'' s professional on all this. Of the states'you
' ve. looked at, which ones do you believe are.
doing the most effective work handling this shift, and are any kind of.
of them relocating as quickly as you think they need to, to achieve.
the goals that all of us want? You can specify.
whose objectives you want to use as a.
reference point for that.NANCY RYAN:
Yeah, I suggest.
that'' s a wonderful question.
That ' s a really difficult.
I mean
, it ' s all about. I assume to me a pair of.
things stick out, is I suggest, I such as how they did it.
in New York, because– as well as Hawaii, because both.
of them were, you understand, the compensation I think provided.
some instructions to start with. And also Hawaii kind of.
like, this is what– these are the questions.
we desire you to respond to as well as how we desire you to do it.And it was a pretty.
compact task. Hawaii is a fairly tiny.
and uncomplicated area. In New york city, they really had.
a rather lean stakeholder process, and also came.
out with a paper and said, OK, simply submit this.
stuff in your price situations. As well as it took them, I.
think, a year and also a half to compose the paper, due to the fact that.
they were busy with various other stuff. As well as this a trouble.
with regulation, is that legislatures and.
regulators' ' passions commonly surpass their methods. Even when I operated at the.
The golden state Compensation, I was simply blown away by the.
amount of paperwork and also process it requires to do anything there.And I proceed to. think that that ' s– it doesn ' t, like the.
As well as so I guess I.
would look at those. I such as just how it'' s functioned.
It ' s type of a collection.
It appears like a whole lot of.
way, with charging ability. That need to own what kinds.
of charging capability, as well as who should have accessibility to that? You'' ve currently talked a.
bit about that benefits as well as who pays. Is there a basic– you see different.
business versions appearing where in some places.
util– and also you in fact offered one instance of utilities.
either might do it or not do it. OEMs could do it or not do it. Towns could do it. Third celebrations can have it.Any general wisdom from.
your perspective on that particular? Claim you were– you might be.
doing this for all I know. Intend you were.
a VC, and you were getting a bunch of.
new company proposals from various.
people who were mosting likely to buy and market basically.
electrical energy from charging ability. So the investment would certainly.
be in charging capacity. Which ones do you believe.
would make the most feeling? Or do you simply need a broad.
variety of opportunities to fit the different.
circumstances one locates in the various.
states and sectors? NANCY RYAN: Well, young boy, there'' s. a whole lot of questions wrapped up in that question. I suggest, I'' m a big follower.
of imaginative damage. This is why I really have pushed.
hard in every territory where I reached speak.
to a regulator. I have constantly pushed hard.
for the make ready design, due to the fact that I believe.
basically that offers an adequate economic.
structure to enable numerous billing.
business to experiment with various kinds of models for.
interfacing with consumers, as well as for pricing.
charging services, or product packaging up subscriptions.And I think that– they ' ve all, I suggest, I guess. the'other point I ' ll state is that I'also assume that that.
cost-free money from the EVSP'' s perspective, from the charging.
company'' s factor of view, that free money needs to be.
conditioned to some degree. Which becomes part of what.
lead to a lot litigation, is just how much it'' s going. to be conditioned. Yet among the points that.
I believe The golden state has actually done and some various other payments.
are thinking around, is that there has to be some.
type of interoperability. Like if the ratepayers, the.
general body of ratepayers are going to subsidize.
your EV charging company, then everybody needs to be.
able to utilize your station.It doesn ' t need to be totally free. However they need to have actually a.
method that they can use it. And they don'' t have to. have a vital chain with 27 different RFID cards on it. They should have the ability to call.
a number or swipe a charge card or whatever. And I believe that'' s important. If there'' s a component. of that question I'didn ' t solution that you. would like me to address, do not hesitate to re-ask it.JOHN WEYANT:
I may, yeah,.
in way I may do that, due to the fact that I'' m going
to. analyze things a little bit. Are there a host of questions on.
what I would certainly call relevant grid integration issues? NANCY RYAN: Yeah. JOHN WEYANT: And I recognize you.
touched on it a bit. However whatever.
from is this system mosting likely to have the ability to take the.
increment and also complete tons? Is it mosting likely to have the ability to.
take care of the various loads in between having.
more renewables on, having billing probably.
doing lorry to grid professions as well as so on. Just how do you see that functioning? I see individuals either say it'' s. absolutely impossible to go really fast or we'' ll work it out.The whole thing will work.
After that it ' s actually. It ' s simply, it ' s a very
. And also they ' ve been investing some. That'' s kind of what ' s. gone on in Hawaii. Once more, it wasn ' t. really something that was determinative.We don'' t need to fret about,
those are simply details. , if we get whatever
established up, if we construct it, they will come efficiently. Exactly how do you see
that collection of problem? NANCY RYAN: Yeah. I imply, this is
something that we truly checked out a great deal from a lot
of different angles at E3. At some point, a few of you
have most likely seen a person from E3 existing on
the PATHWAYS design, which is an energy system
COVID economic dilemma hit.
And what they ' ve. spent to fit the
cars and trucks that have actually been. sold today is pretty modest.
That will certainly end up being. a concern moving forward.
It ' s something. that they should be able to intend complete forward. I assume there ' s some– there ' s a whole lot of. various modern technologies'to solve that trouble. JOHN WEYANT: Two. a lot more quick ones. If you were suggesting
. an energy, which it sounds like you do.
a whole lot, exactly how would certainly you encourage them to prioritize–.
You in fact did touch on this clearly.
didn'' t say excessive about it. Would certainly you choose the.
light obligation lorries for the commercial market.
for municipal EV fleets? Is there anything, any type of.
basic guidance in that location? NANCY RYAN: I believe it really.
depends on where you are.I imply, if you'' re– I mean, very first of. all, everyone, it ' s fundamental to do something for.
light task cars, I think, unless you specifically serve.
an area where people simply wear'' t have– you'understand, if you ' re. like a country co-op in Montana, that must probably.
not be your top priority. If there'' s like.
a meat packaging plant that trucks go in and out of all.
the moment, [INAUDIBLE] college, then maybe you ought to be.
thinking of the trucks.The method they
' ve looked at it for.
customers is, past light obligation, after that what are the major.
industrial as well as commercial transportation relevant.
loads in your area? Has your transit firm.
made a decision that they wish to energize their fleet? Or do you have huge multi-modal.
depots or a port, or– so I believe there, it'' s
all. very location particular, and you actually need.
a custom evaluation. JOHN WEYANT: One.
last inquiry that'' s show up in most of the workshops. this quarter from absolutely different angles is, when.
you start down the EV roadway, for how long previously.
shock, shock, it ends up that gas cell.
electrical cars are actually an also better concept? I presume for you, do you really feel the.
system has actually been established in a method that kind of compromises,.
it'' s type of a lock-in path problem.Do you assume the.
current efforts could sort of healthy hydrogen. fuel cell cars? Or would
it be something else? Or are we making. financial investments that we ' ll
regret since we'should have. recognized that the hydrogen fuel cell automobiles would. ultimately defeat out the EVs? Exactly how do you come out. on that particular set of problems? NANCY RYAN: Yeah, it ' s a. truly fascinating concern.
I mean, the air board has truly. headed out of their method for years to call it a zero discharge. lorry program, to have a gas cell course to compliance. They truly intended to determine. a way to finance the billing, or the hydrogen refueling. network for autos.
They thought they were going. to make use of the Reduced Carbon Fuel
Requirement to get the. refiners to pay for it, but that didn ' t take place. And also there ' s a small number. of'stations in The golden state as well as truly no area else. Which, I believe, has. led every one of the major OEMs
to just think, well,. we ' ve obtained to have an electric gamer in the video game. My understanding, though,. is that the bigger element is actually China, where they ' ve. truly gone greatly electric.And that ' s really the. tail that ' s wagging– or it ' s the pet dog. that'' s– we ' re the tail
. They ' re the canines. JOHN'WEYANT: Great. Well, thanks for. a fantastic seminar and also for addressing all these.
inquiries so masterfully. I think you just.
confirmed my theory that you'' re one of.
minority individuals alive that in fact can play three.
dimensional chess while roller skating. Many thanks once more– NANCY RYAN: [ INAUDIBLE], John. JOHN WEYANT: We'' ll. seek you on school below with– particularly.
with the [FAINT] program later on as quickly as.
we'' re green light to travel. NANCY RYAN: Great, thank you. JOHN WEYANT: Great,.
many thanks a lot.
It ' s something. I assume there ' s some– there ' s a great deal of. NANCY RYAN: Yeah, it ' s a. actually interesting inquiry.
And also there ' s a moderate number. They ' re the pet dogs.